Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome to Retrained Search, the podcast where we lift the lid on what it's really like to work retained, discuss the stories we've gathered along the way and give you all a peek behind the scenes of our amazing community and how they're getting ahead.

Speaker 2: 0:21

Episode 100 and not a clue.

Speaker 1: 0:23

Episode 100 and not a clue. Welcome everyone to the typical start of one of our podcasts, which is us not really knowing where we are, what we're supposed to be doing. We're just doing what we're told to the Retained Search show and we're absolutely delighted today to be joined by Ross, who it's been a while. Ross hasn't it Like? I was trying to think just then. When did we actually like last see you? It wouldn't have been Dubai, would it Like in Cundeson Was the last time we saw you.

Speaker 3: 0:53

No, it was Amishun. Amishun was the last time. Yeah, we all sat down together. I still Ross.

Speaker 1: 0:59

I still tell people about that game of golf that was the hottest game of golf I have ever had in my life.

Speaker 2: 1:07

Yeah, june in dubai, and everyone was like, george, you cannot take customers to play golf in dubai. And I was like no, no, I can't. We're gonna do night golf. It's gonna be like 8 30, it's gonna be dark, we're gonna be fine. I think it was like 47 degrees at half nine at night or something like that, with no wind at all.

Speaker 3: 1:23

I don't think I've sweated so much in my life no, that and that was just walking from the taxi to the pro shop, wasn't it? It was just so, so hot. Um, it was, it was great, it was great fun.

Speaker 2: 1:35

But yeah, it was the yeah, the temperature dial down 20 degrees. It'd have been even more fun. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:42

Oh, it was good times, really good times. What a trip. So, for those of you listening, please, ross, will you tell everybody who you are and introduce yourself and your business, who you are and what you do.

Speaker 3: 1:59

Yeah, so I'm Ross Sanderson. I'm the Group Director of Solutions for the STR Group. We are a SME, a STEM-led recruitment business. We have five core business areas that we focus on. We've got an office in the UK, We've got a small office in the US and a small office in Switzerland as well, and we operate across life sciences, maritime automation, engineering, architecture and what have we got there? Yeah, that's the five.

Speaker 1: 2:35

Is it?

Speaker 3: 2:36

That five yeah life sciences.

Speaker 1: 2:38

Yeah, that's five. Yeah, very good, thank you. Thank you very much. And when was it? I can't even remember how long ago it was that we met. It would have been what?

Speaker 2: 2:49

three four it was before I joined Retrained and that was like end of 21. So it must have been early 2021 or earlier. Yeah, it was?

Speaker 3: 2:59

It was 2021. We started doing the course. I think it was May, may, sort of time 2021.

Speaker 1: 3:09

And tell us a little bit about what was going on then. Why did you, why did we come across each other? Why did we end up? Why did you end up going through the programme? What was happening?

Speaker 3: 3:19

Yeah, so I was leading one of our brands, the Maritime brand. So I was leading one of our brands, the Maritime brand. We were very much a perm heavy probably 8% perm, 20%, contract or contingent and I've been doing it for years and I just got to the point where it just became frustrating. You know you'd have great months and then you'd have months where you'd have a few dropouts and you know you'd miss your target and it was just that kind of constant churn of contingent recruitment. And I remember a friend of mine said to me they'd just done this course and had I heard of Louise Archer and this was obviously before you were the household name that you are now and everyone knows who Louise Archer is and I said, no, who's that? Um? And he told me about the course, told me about the training, um. And I was like, well, that's, that's what we need, um. So I sort of spoke internally um to to my boss and the board discussed it and agreed that yes, this is the kind of training that we would be interested in, um.

Speaker 3: 4:21

And then it went, went from there and we put a cohort through of which I was sort of. I didn't do it, I sort of sat on it as the the person from the business to make sure that everybody was doing what they were supposed to do, but just by sort of sitting and listening to it all and then watching it all. It was sort of a light bulb moment for me that this is, you know, what we should be doing and you know, applying it to situations that I had over the years working contingent roles, where I'm thinking, god, I could have done this then and it would have made such a difference, or this is how I could have pitched it and potentially tried to get that or work that opportunity. So, yeah, that was, that was sort of how we came to to do the course.

Speaker 1: 5:02

And so was it new for you guys. It was you weren't doing much or any retained work. Were you at the time?

Speaker 3: 5:10

We'd done a little bit in our life sciences brand, but I think that was probably more deposit for exclusive rather than actually doing a full retained search. You know, we were getting deposit and we were focusing on them and then trying to fill their roles, so we didn't have certainly nowhere near the level of what we do now through, you know, the doing, the course and everything that's come since. So, yeah, not, not really any and so what was it like?

Speaker 1: 5:38

like would you be able to share what happened really? And because it's really, it's really interesting and I want to because it's, as you know, ross, it was similar to what happened to me and it it was, um, in many ways, can you share like with with the audience what, what it was like, what happened as you went through that court, through the course happened as you went through that course and as you went and things started to happen in the business.

Speaker 3: 6:10

Yeah, yeah, so we did the course. I was obviously embedded in our maritime brand, so we started to sell retained business within the maritime business and do quite well. Everybody agreed that we could then replicate this across the group. You know, we sat down we talked about it, um, and how we were going to do it, and I was really enthused gonna start working with the wider group, um, and then it went nowhere for three, three or four months, um, we carried on selling it in in navis, my the maritime brand that I was in.

Speaker 3: 6:44

But, yeah, that was that kind of challenge and I obviously spoke to you about it.

Speaker 3: 6:49

I remember you telling me you've got to create pockets of success and then start shouting about them. And it just sort of started to snowball Once we won one in a different business and delivered it and people started taking notice and we started talking about it more at our monthly sales meetings and shouting about the wins and what we're doing. Then, you know, more and more people were coming to me with problems and, yeah, it did. It just sort of snowballed from there into the point where I was doing them across the whole group, where it became unsustainable for me to stay in my role as head of the maritime business that I then moved into this solutions role across the whole group. So it was that really, it was just started with ones and twos and then it just grew into what has become single searches, projects, all sorts of different stuff. That's all been retained and implementing some really cool solutions with clients, which has been good. But yeah, it was definitely a challenge getting everybody to come on board, shall we say.

Speaker 1: 7:51

Yeah, tell us a bit about that then. What was the difficulty there? What were the roadblocks for you?

Speaker 3: 7:59

The biggest challenge that we had was that it was people's perception of what a retainer was or what was going to be expected of them. You know, you say to somebody we're going to do this job for a client, we're going to get paid a deposit, we're going to put this process in place and they'll go. Yeah, that sounds amazing. But in reality they were all like, oh no, I'm going to have to fill this job. If we do this, I have to fill it. You know, and I hadn't identified that early enough because everyone was telling me like, yeah, this, this sounds great. So once we actually sat down and spoke to people and was like, well, you know, you're not, you're not committing to fill the job.

Speaker 3: 8:34

Obviously you hope you're going to fill the job, but what you're committing to is a process that you're going to implement, um with the client that you agree, that you're going to follow and you're going to feed back all the information to them which will allow them to make key strategic decisions around hiring for their business, which should hopefully result in a hire. But if it doesn't, it won't be because you haven't done what you were supposed to do. So you started addressing that with people and then people then suddenly write okay, that makes more sense. So it's just kind of unpicking those, those kind of preconceptions around it. Um, and there's always people that have done it a certain way forever and don't want to change. You know, you have, and you just, you know, as long as they're doing, okay, you just let them get, get on with it. But yeah, it's, it was that that was the biggest sort of roadblock to overcome. Was that kind of misconception that I hadn't even realized was there um, I completely agree.

Speaker 1: 9:28

I remember you sending me and I found it the other day. I remember you sending me an email of uh, I'm gonna have to find it, um, because it made me laugh out loud literally when I found it the other day. Uh, and I hope you won't mind me sharing this, and if you, do I know what you're going to shout the one in the school group.

Speaker 1: 9:46

You're going to doubt, but you sent me an email saying we've done some analysis this morning between retained and contingent. You might have even put it in the group Based on our fill rates and average fees, you would need to work on 120 contingent jobs in a year to bill 150K. You need to do 6.5 retainers to bill 150k and yet I still have to work every day to convince people. It made me laugh.

Speaker 3: 10:14

It's like I would always double check my maths because maths was never my strong points. But yeah, the message was obviously you have to work on a lot more contingent jobs than you do with retainers, um, and it's it's that obviously people, I think, certainly with more experienced people that the way they sell to a client, it's their network and how long they've been in the market and how they've got access to candidates that other people have got. So they're kind of the client sat there going, yeah, yeah, this sounds amazing, like this person is going to find me, these people. But then, of course, they put the phone down and they're saying it to five or six other clients and you're working in that contingent space and not working all these jobs. So it's kind of getting people to pause.

Speaker 3: 10:56

And yes, you're an expert and yes, you've got this network, but you still need to implement these more robust searches when the client's got the challenge. To implement these more robust searches when the client's got the challenge, not what, it's not what you've got, it's what the client's challenge is, um, and and you know, again, it's that kind of further further education around that. But but yeah, when I, when I sat those numbers out, I was kind of baffled um to be fair. But yeah, it's not, it's not like that. No, I don't have to work quite as hard to to convince people to uh, to do retainers or to work in that way.

Speaker 3: 11:26

I am.

Speaker 2: 11:28

There was a guy, do you know a guy called alex amosi, seeing him. He's the guy that owns school, the platform that we use, right, and I saw a video the other day and someone asked him can lazy people be successful? And he said often some of the most successful people are lazy because they don't work hard like they work smart, like their first thought is how can I get from a to b as quickly as possible and as effectively as possible? And I kind of think sometimes I've this. People have this misconception that, like, working on a retained basis is harder, but when you consider those numbers, like just the easiest way for me to be and yeah, more often than not yeah, absolutely, absolutely it's.

Speaker 3: 12:11

Um, yeah, I mean, look, contingent. I mean contingent will always have a place when there's, you know the skill sets are readily available and you know we say to people if you know five people in your area that you can put across this job, that you know you're going to get quick feedback, interviews and stuff like that, do it. But this is like it's about. When the client's got that challenge. That's what it always comes back to, isn't it like I always remember you guys saying dig for the pain, get your shovel out, dig for the pain, and it's that it's not you but you but you.

Speaker 3: 12:40

It's not. It's not you telling the client how great you are. You've got to let the client tell you what's happened, what's brought them to the point that they're now sat on a call with you talking about recruitment. And it can't just be because they just want to give you jobs. There's got to be a story behind it. Whether it's new, whether it's aged, whether it's confidential, whatever it is, there is a reason why that client needs help and you've got to find it. That's kind of the key thing. You start thinking about it like that and you're talking to people and they start thinking about it like that. That's when things start to happen.

Speaker 2: 13:16

That's where the word solution comes from in your job title, right yeah.

Speaker 3: 13:19

Yeah, the solutions guy.

Speaker 1: 13:22

Which is so interesting because, again, it's these misconceptions and these preconceptions. Often, when I meet people that have got a business like yours, like the STR group, with multi layers of contingent teams and contract teams more often than not, and often different practice areas or functional disciplines not, and often different practice areas or functional disciplines, the the thought process around setting up a retained division is very much almost always like oh, we'll make this a separate brand and it will be an executive search division and we'll, you know, put some people in pinstripe suits from you know the cities in there there and they've got some retained experience and they can do all the senior stuff. I mean, I very rarely see that work well and that's not been the way that I did it and it's not been the way you've done it either.

Speaker 2: 14:17

It's a little bit different isn't it.

Speaker 1: 14:19

Can you tell us a little bit like how and why kind of it's different to that?

Speaker 3: 14:25

Can you tell us a little bit like how and why kind of it's different to that? It's all delivered through the brands. You know, I think if we were going to set up without the knowledge that we had, we would have done what you just said there. We would have set up a separate exec search division and it would have been completely disconnected from the businesses that are actually doing the recruitment. The way, like I say, the way that we've done it is, we've grown it through the brands.

Speaker 3: 14:50

My role is to go in and help them win the business, then to work with the consultants to make sure that they deliver it properly. So it's not we're not taking away or it's not seen to be taking away from the brands. It's all done within the brands, delivered within the brands. Um, the consultants, you know they, they obviously they own the fee that they generate. There's not a percentage of the fee that comes to a separate, you know, exec search team or anything like like that. I'm purely seen as there to help their clients and help them deliver a better service for their clients. Um, so that that's, that's how it worked. I think, oh, that's how it has worked, which you know, obviously, was how you recommended that we do it well, and I see it work again and again.

Speaker 1: 15:33

And in fact I'm working with another uh guy in um, a finance firm, who is in a very similar situation and so tempted to set up a shiny, sexy executive practice that's going to take all the senior work away from and, not surprising, immediately all the consultants are going. Oh no, I'm sorry, I can't take you out to go and see that client. You know, I mean, why would they?

Speaker 2: 15:57

why would they you?

Speaker 1: 15:58

know, and then the nice juicy stuff that they really want to get to is going to end up going somewhere else. It doesn't make sense. So you're kind of you know you're fighting each other and I love the whole solutions thing. But I think there's also a preconception that if you do that and keep it, you know within the same arena that you almost don't. You can't then push up into the more senior and you know the more complex, you know more strategic type projects and I mean, tell us what, what's your experience of that? What type of work has it kind of taken you into?

Speaker 3: 16:33

yeah, yeah, we've done everything from c-suite through to, like I said, multi-hire projects, I think, where, where they bring me in, it allows them to separate what they would do normally for the client having the solutions directly come in and talk about different solutions. So it's not them selling it when they the consultant. Oh sorry, the client already knows the consultant as a contingent consultant. That's filled jobs for them. However, they bring me into the call and I'm somebody different and I specialize in different solutions and they're showing the client well, we've got these different ways of working. That means we use ross and he's going to talk you through them and then that opens up the that you know the what, the why, the wins and the different types of business. But but yeah, we've done, let's say, c-suite roles. The stuff I really like doing is that the multi-hire projects and I had a great example of that earlier, sorry, at the end of last year with a client who were looking for. They needed to mobilize hvac engineers not the most sexiest of industries for specialist facilities that have really complex air conditioning systems, that they have to be kept at certain temperatures, and they needed people that were going all over Europe to kind of service, install and fix these, these units, but but they're struggling to to find them. So we we put a project to team together and they retained us. We agreed a strategy of how we're going to go after them and you know we found them six people, um, who all started in January.

Speaker 3: 18:02

You know so that was a. You know a big, big amount of chunk of money that started in January. You know so that was a. You know a big, big amount of chunk of money that came in January for us Great case study. You know it kind of it's something that you can mobilize quickly. You know, caught up in loads of red tape and paperwork and things like that. You know we were retained and so we were, you know, got a nice retainer from them to actually focus on and do this piece of business.

Speaker 3: 18:24

That's the kind of stuff that I like doing, those kind of those juicy projects like that where you know you're multi-hiring people. You know we've got a great case study from that now that we're using, you know, to try and win more projects like that across these different centres. But that's the exact kind of project that you know five years ago we had done contingent because it was hard and the skill sets they were looking for were niche. It wasn't just any old, you know air conditioning engineer that could do it. We probably would have took it on, worked it for a bit, realised it was really hard and the consultant would have lost interest and gone on to something that was easier to work. But because of the process that we did, you know it became a really good project that you know we've done really well from and now we've, you know, got more work from that client as well, as they continue to to grow.

Speaker 1: 19:15

What difference has it made to the bottom line for you moving and getting good at securing work on a retained basis?

Speaker 3: 19:23

Yeah, massive, massive amount of difference. Having that kind of forecastable revenue. It's not even just the bottom line. What I look at is, like consultants who were struggling or weren't doing very well, all of a sudden you help them land some retained business and deliver retained business. Then all of a sudden you've got somebody completely re-engaged that's doing well and growing and going from there. So it's not even the bottom line. Yes, we've, we've added lots of revenue in this way. You know we used to do a lot of contingent um anyway, but we've, we've definitely added to that. But it's that it's kind of those people bought in, loving what they're doing, enjoying working on it, coming to me and going right, I need another one, I need you to help me. You know it's that kind of way. That's the real rewarding thing and that's kind of helping our business to continue to grow.

Speaker 1: 20:13

Yeah, and by the sounds of it, you've moved on significantly from being seen as the you know. No, I don't want to have anything to do with that to um, now they kind of want you involved with what they're doing.

Speaker 3: 20:29

Yeah, yeah yeah, definitely, definitely. I wrote some numbers down. Actually, um, in terms of last year, we sold over 700 000 pounds worth of retained projects last year. Now, that wasn't all invoice last year. Some of that's obviously rolled into this year, just by where we are and doing the projects.

Speaker 1: 20:46

But yeah, you know that you can't say that's not made a big impact on the bottom line I mean, I don't know what it was at before, but what sort of amount of retained work were you doing before you went on the journey?

Speaker 3: 20:59

oh, minimal, it would be ones and twos and, like, like I said earlier, it was there, it would be a deposit to go and find them someone rather than a full retained search, but not a lot.

Speaker 2: 21:10

And for any of you listening that are taking deposits we're doing a webinar about that in a week, aren't we?

Speaker 1: 21:16

Yeah, it is like, as Ross says, it isn't the same and actually it can be quite frustrating and, well, a little bit dangerous, because you can take a deposit and then not, and then struggle with the delivery and it can it can damage your customer relationship. So, uh, please, if you're wondering about that, please come to the webinar we're doing on the. What did you say it was? There's something of february hang on.

Speaker 2: 21:41

Yeah, I'm gonna come back to you on that, okay, thank you um, I did.

Speaker 3: 21:51

I did it with uh, one of the first ones I ever sold. Um, I didn't. I thought I'm not going to use competency assessments because I don't need them.

Speaker 3: 21:55

Um, and then my shortlist all got rejected. I had to basically start again. Um, yeah, no, but basically, yeah, I thought I don't need them. They're not that important. I've, I know everything about retainers. Now I've done the course. Um, yeah, you think you know winning the deposit is the the win, but it's not. It's doing the proper process. So I learned a valuable lesson there. I was very humbled, but, yeah, we were able to restate the search, do it properly and fill it for the client. Um, but uh, yeah, don't, don't just take a deposit and do a contingent search. Is is my advice.

Speaker 2: 22:31

Yeah, yeah, it's the 8th 18th.

Speaker 1: 22:34

18th of feb at 5 pm uk yeah, so join, that it's free, it doesn't cost a penny, um it and will be helpful. And what, what? What other kind of bits of and pieces of have you learned kind of along the way that you think would be helpful for people to know, or traps that you might have fallen into that you think, yeah, I know, if I'd had my time again, I I might do it a bit differently? Have you got advice to share for people that are embarking on this sort of journey?

Speaker 3: 23:12

Yeah, I think in terms of I think advice, it's Obviously, as I said. It's doing the proper diagnosis with the client and making sure that you're selling the appropriate solution. It's then making sure that the client fully understands the process and the timeline and everything you're doing and you clearly define. You know this is what the briefing meeting is going to be. This is what it's for, this is what the competency assessments are for. You know this is what the talent mapping process looks like. You know, based on what we've agreed, this is what the headhunting process is going to look like, and you know what we're going to need from you to enable us to do that really well. You know it's just making sure that the client fully understands what you're agreeing to and also that they're accountable as well. You know you're agreeing with a client a process that will only work if they do what they need to do as well. So if you're, if they agree, to do two stage interviews and then, all of a sudden, it's now a four stage interview process and you're waiting for some director from holland to fly over to do a final stage. That was never agreed at the start, you know. And then it falls apart. That's not because of us, that's because you've changed the process. So I think that's a big pitfall is being you've got to be strong with your clients and you've got to be really clear and agree with them and if they're not happy with something, then you discuss it and you make sure that everyone's on the same page.

Speaker 3: 24:36

I think that's, I guess, the best advice I'll give anybody who's going into retained searches Clearly define the process, clearly follow the process, clearly communicate to your clients any challenges that you're having, because they will help you or they will tell you how to fix it. Don't hide anything from them and wait till the end. I think what I like to do is we like to present the long list to the clients and go through who we found and then work on selecting the short list with them, and then obviously you shouldn't have a short list that's rejected anyway. But if they've picked their own short list, they can't then turn around and say that it's not right. So I think that's advice I would give people doing retained search Don't be scared of it. Don't be scared of stuff will go't. Don't be scared of like what stuff will go wrong yeah you're dealing with people.

Speaker 3: 25:27

You're not. If they were easy to find, then they wouldn't either, so don't be scared of what will go wrong. Learn from it, um, feed it back to the client and make sure that, yeah, you're making decisions with their knowledge and input and I mean it's just music's by ears, I'm like oh Ross.

Speaker 2: 25:45

I'm just saying anything.

Speaker 1: 25:47

God Ross, you're good yeah, I mean, um, somebody's taught you well, and and what was I gonna say? Um, yeah, I guess I was gonna say like, is that what you thought it was? You know when you signed up for, when you thought, oh yeah, let's, let's get some retain stuff going on, is, is that what you thought it was going to be? Like all this, a lot of people I just think a lot of people underestimate the whole process side. They think you just, or just going to get retainer and then like, yeah, get rich quick and dance off into the sunset, and they don't really realize the stuff that has to happen in return.

Speaker 3: 26:24

I thought the hard bit would be selling them.

Speaker 1: 26:26

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 26:28

And the hard bit is delivering flawlessly the process. You know, as long as you do your diagnosis properly with the client, then you can make a compelling case. Now they might not buy it, or they might not buy it now, they might need their process to run on a bit longer before they buy it, but you make a compelling case. That is actually another challenge. Thinking about it, we would, or people would talk about it. The client would say no and they just immediately defer to contingent because they wanted to get the job on. But yeah, we're quite strict now on. If we offer a solution that we feel is right and the client doesn't want to buy it, then that's fine, they can go and do what they want and then we'll wait. They'll either come back to us or they won't, but we won't commit to doing something contingent if we feel it should be right for a retained process or engaged process. So yeah, no for me.

Speaker 3: 27:19

I thought it would be getting a deposit from a client. That was what it was Not. Yeah, no for me, I was. I thought it would be getting a deposit from a client. That that was. That was what it was not. Not without realizing because I've been recruiting for a long time. You know retained or exec search isn't a new concept. So you hear of it, you're aware of it, but you just think, like they pay you a deposit and you go and find them, the people, and it's exec level, so it's just senior people rather than mid-level people. But you, you know, I had no idea Just what went into it.

Speaker 1: 27:48

That's so good. I mean it's helpful for people to listen to your story. I mean, is there something you wish you'd have known earlier? Is there anything that you yeah, that you've later learned and wish you knew earlier?

Speaker 3: 28:08

yeah, I wish I'd met you 10 years earlier um and not, and not spend so long doing contingent ironic ross, because you wish you'd have met lou 10 years earlier.

Speaker 2: 28:17

If you'd have come six months later, you'd have had me instead and would have been even better.

Speaker 3: 28:20

Yeah no, I think, yeah, it's just. It's just that I mean things I'd known earlier. Yeah, I just wish I'd known about this. I wish I'd known about how you could do this. You know we were, or still are, really good contingent recruitment business. You know we work with clients and have done very well to grow our business. So it's not like it was we were struggling in any way. It was just a case of for me, I wanted more, I wanted to work in a different way and I wanted to move away from that contingent where you see people put so much into a process and then their candidate doesn't get offered or the client just disappears or it's all on hold or there's an internal candidate, you see, and you just, I think every time it happens it just breaks a little piece off a good recruiter and and I just got. I got to that point like I was just like I've had enough, I need to, I need to look to do, do a different way of working.

Speaker 2: 29:23

Can I ask Ross because I think often people talk about billings and how has it improved the business? You've got a young family. You talk about changing the way of working. How did it affect your family life?

Speaker 3: 29:36

Has it? Yeah, certainly from the rewards. I mean yeah, certainly from the rewards, I mean absolutely. I mean for me it's affected in that I really enjoyed my job running my team, but I also knew I'd reached the point where it just didn't fulfill me anymore. So, from a moving into my job now and working across our group, it's allowed me to elevate in the business, which and everything that comes with that. So I'm happier in my job. You know, ultimately happier it's happier at home.

Speaker 3: 30:12

Um, so yeah, and yeah, I mean obviously your earnings increase the more you you climb up and the more you're doing and things like that. But you know, it's never. It's never about. I've always thought like if, if you're doing well, the money sort of takes care of itself and stuff like that. I'm not somebody that focuses too much on that. As long as I'm paying my bills and I've got enough to do what I want to do, then that's fine, it's, it's all about the enjoyment. So, yeah, it's definitely changed, changed the course of my career without a doubt, like without a doubt and now you have a horse or half a horse half the horse alone.

Speaker 1: 30:49

Yeah and I didn't persuade you on that at all that was nothing to do with it.

Speaker 3: 30:57

Horse riding is an expensive hobby.

Speaker 2: 31:00

I've got a little daughter now. Lou, you ever try and have the conversation with me about a horse.

Speaker 3: 31:04

I'm ending that zoom call quicker than you know is possible ross is grateful yeah, it was almost like grace had briefed you before we spoke because it just came at like the right time and you just said everything. It was like, yeah, I was like I'm trying to check her phone and see if she had your number, but yeah, no, things like that are nice, that you're able to, you know, do things like that for your kids. And, yeah, my daughter's well into horse riding, my son's football obsessed, although he thinks he's a Liverpool fan, which will make Jordan happy, which makes me really sad.

Speaker 2: 31:42

You've raised him well, Ross. You've raised him well.

Speaker 3: 31:46

Yeah, he's football crazy. He's at that age where he's got like a million different shirts, different clubs, including a Sunderland shirt that he sometimes wears my nephew is, I think, my nephew's seven and my cousin.

Speaker 2: 32:01

I sit next to my cousin at the Liverpool match and he said to me it was World Book Day. In school this was like might have been six months ago. You know they go dressed as a character out of a book. He said James. My son came down with his football sticker book in his Barcelona kit and said he was Lionel Messi and I had to explain to him. I don't think that's how World Book Day works. I like it.

Speaker 3: 32:23

Messi will be in a few books.

Speaker 1: 32:25

I'm sure I think love and we, having worked with you quite closely over the last couple of years, love the journey that you've been on and seen kind of first hand the transformation that you've made in your career, yourself and your business. What's next Like? What does the future hold? What does this year and the next few years look like for you?

Speaker 3: 32:59

Yeah, just to continue to grow the business. You know we've we're looking to grow more internationally. So get more involved with that. I hope more involved with kind of the commercial aspect of the business, you know, selling and client development and things like that, and looking at the way that we do things, hopefully adding in different solutions as well, that that come up, that we say that will work for us. So, yeah, just just work hard, work with the, the other board directors, and hope that you know, yeah, the business continues to grow and flourish and do really well well, we amen to that all the very best for all of the endeavors and we'll always be here to help if you want a sounding board or advice.

Speaker 1: 33:43

It's been such a joy to be a part of the endeavors and we'll always be here to help if you want a sounding board or advice. It's been such a joy to be a part of the journey. Um, if people are curious about you, your story, your business, and want to reach out, can they, or are you kind of tied up with loads of stuff at the moment and kind of rather they didn't, yeah, just drop me a message on LinkedIn.

Speaker 3: 34:03

I'm on LinkedIn, so yeah, I'll respond to people if they have any questions.

Speaker 1: 34:09

Cool. I know there'll be people listening that are inspired by the story and you and the business that you run, so please then feel free to reach out to Ross Sanderson on LinkedIn at STR Group. All right, folks, that's it for today, ross. You've been an absolute star. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank you. George, as always, and we'll see you next time.

Speaker 2: 34:39

See you soon, thank you See you.

Speaker 1: 34:42

Well, that's another episode of Retrained Search the podcast in the bag. Thanks for listening to our wild tales, LinkedIn controversies and our top tips on how to sell and deliver Retained Search. Get involved in our next episode. Send in your questions and share your experiences with us by emailing podcast at retrainedsearchcom. And don't be shy. Connect with us on LinkedIn and come and say hi, we don't bite, Unless you're a Shrek firm, that is.

Speaker 1: 35:11

We want to say a special thank you to our Retrained members for sharing what's working for them right now and innovating new ways to grow and evolve. It's an incredible community. If you're wondering what exactly we mean when we mention our communities, well, we have two separate programs. Our Search Foundations program is for recruiters who want to learn how to sell and deliver retained search solutions consistently, and we have our Search Mastery program. That's for business leaders or owners already at 50% retained or more and looking to scale and grow and structure their search firm. We cap memberships to these programs to protect the integrity of the community. If you want access, just talk to us. Okay, thanks for listening. We'll be back very soon with another episode of Retrain Search the podcast.