Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome to Retrained Search, the podcast where we lift the lid on what it's really like to work retained, discuss the stories we've gathered along the way and give you all a peek behind the scenes of our amazing community and how they're getting ahead. Hello everybody, and welcome to the Retained Search show, as we've now decided to call it. And I've just said to Jordan oh, should I go put some lipstick on? And he said no, I'm not.

Speaker 2: 0:35

No, not today, Not strictly for weekends. Do you watch strictly? I don't. No, no, I don't. I don't watch TV anymore, you just watch football. I watch a lot of sport, and then, oh, recently there's a new thing on Sky called the Day of the Jackal.

Speaker 1: 0:54

Oh, I've seen that advertised.

Speaker 2: 0:56

Very good, it looks good. Did you watch?

Speaker 1: 0:59

Slow Horses, when that was on.

Speaker 2: 1:01

No, you told me to.

Speaker 1: 1:06

Oh God was on. No, you told me. Oh god, that's good. Yeah, I need to. Yeah, it's good. Anyone that's watched slow horses? I think george should watch it. Then, um, send him a message and tell him it's really good yeah and my brother's just started watching it.

Speaker 2: 1:13

He's hooked yeah, I need to start. I'm going to apologize if there's any weird grimaces. It's not something lou just said. I slipped a disc in my back at the weekend, so it's. It's a painful few days. Yes, yesterday.

Speaker 1: 1:26

You did it playing tennis, didn't you?

Speaker 2: 1:27

Did you? Yeah, did you win the point? Yeah, honestly, it was such a great shot. It really was. I spent all day like a bit uncomfortable in my back and because I'm so tall I'm 6'5" I do have some back issues every now and again and I thought I just slept funny on it and I probably shouldn't have played tennis. In hindsight, but at the time I wasn't thinking in that way. So I played tennis and they served that wide to my forehand and they hit this big forehand and the minute I hit it I went oh no, oh God. I spent the weekend like crawling around the house. Oh no, yeah. Rolling around the house oh no, yeah. Yesterday I had to get Becca to come and open the fridge to get the milk out. I wasn't strong enough to open the fridge and when I stopped for petrol I didn't have enough power in my hands to squeeze the petrol pump. I had to get the guy to come out of the shop and put the petrol in the car for me.

Speaker 1: 2:20

I'm laughing, but it sounds awful. Yeah, it's all right. I'm laughing, but it sounds awful. Yeah, it's all right, I'm so sorry for you.

Speaker 2: 2:25

It settles down over the course of a week or so.

Speaker 1: 2:26

And you have to have tummy time, don't you?

Speaker 2: 2:32

I've been doing our team calls and laying on my stomach with two pillows under me, as advised by the physio. So it's been an interesting few days.

Speaker 1: 2:39

Oh, bless you, Bless you. I almost fell over in Tennessee today. That's the first time I've almost fallen over and that's like I obviously don't run around as much as I should.

Speaker 1: 2:48

I went sliding. We've got these like artificial, as you know, because you played on the like artificial grass and artificial clay and it's better than very sandy and they've just re-sanded them and it's you can just like slide around all over the place. Well, I don't. All the guys do. They go sliding in for the shots and I don't. I kind of potter off the fool's game, this slide.

Speaker 2: 3:06

I don't move fast enough to slide, oh, don't you now?

Speaker 1: 3:10

every time I've tried to slide, I see them sliding around and over the place. It's really cool to watch, but I'm not a slider I just nearly did the splits. That's what happened to me.

Speaker 2: 3:26

The idea of the game is that I don't have to slide and I make the other person do all of the sliding right. That's the plan, right? Surely I don't actually stand there and make their moves? That should be.

Speaker 1: 3:36

You're a very, very good tennis player. So any tips I will take from you. Um, we've been busy as well, haven't we, jesus? And so have, um, our community, our members, have been super busy, uh, so let's share some of the stuff that's been going on, uh, oh, this is I. Love, love, love, love, love this.

Speaker 1: 3:58

I had a wonderful conversation with, uh, one of them, uh, our members, who joined us would have been a couple of years ago now.

Speaker 1: 4:05

She was completely contingent, quite frustrated, should we say, and not enjoying the contingent model at all, her own very small business, and she sent me this wonderful message I hope you're well, had a good weekend.

Speaker 1: 4:24

I booked time with you two weeks today in the hope of discussing joining Search Mastery, and to join Search Mastery, you need to be 50% at least retained. So that was a nice little green flag for me, because I thought she must've been doing really well. Then she goes on to say, having had the most successful six months of my career, I'm conscious that you and Retrained helped turn my business around, equipping me with the tools to become a genuine search partner. I'm so grateful for your guidance and would like to continue to be part of the community, and I want to scale and would like your advice on how best to do so. If there's space in the next cohort, I want to learn more about it, and that was a few days ago and she is now a part of search mastery and I'm so excited to be helping. Coming to richmond yeah, we've got an in-person event going on I was about to say, in a few months in a few months, jesus.

Speaker 1: 5:14

No, it's like in a three weeks time, uh, the 9th and 10th of december. Uh, in richmond, just outside london, not far fromrow. If you are 50% retained and you want to sit in a room full of other search, global search experts, leaders, business owners, business leaders and learn more about growing, scaling, getting better and mastering your craft, please get in touch and I'll tell you all about it.

Speaker 2: 5:43

I've done a lot of retained over the years and and still blows my mind every time I sit in that room some of the stuff that's incredible. It's just, yeah, it's so so incredible I love, love.

Speaker 1: 5:54

Bringing the people together and um watching them all learn from each other. Uh, this is cool, isn't it? Jord?

Speaker 2: 6:03

yeah, this is harriet. So harriet said we're holding off. We were holding off on posting this until contracts were signed, but we're excited to announce that in the last few weeks we've taken on three new searches or higher up the value chain conversation with you, lou, probably a month ago, two months ago yeah, and I and I really put a real push on.

Speaker 1: 6:24

So harriet's in the mastermind group um, put a real push on moving up the value chain. Uh, about about six weeks ago. She says um, this shift has nearly doubled our average fee already. Um, yeah, about six, eight weeks, meaning that we now have to work on half the number of searches to achieve the same results. The first third of fees will be going out tomorrow and it's more than we normally bill in a month. So we're thrilled. Massive thanks for your guidance and support.

Speaker 2: 6:48

Um, if there's any way I can return the favor she's so generous, uh, let us know she helped me out by um running the last 20 minutes of the co-op so I could go to physio oh bless her.

Speaker 1: 7:00

She is so good. She's a super star. Tell us about this. Yeah, this is josh um the.

Speaker 2: 7:06

The title was a bit misleading because he said successful retain process at last and that implies that he's been struggling. He's not, he's been absolutely flying. But I think this is just one search where the delivery is dragged on a little bit. He said he's finally wrapped up a retainer which started all the way back in june. Fair to say, this was a challenge, with the recruitment freeze implemented by the client midway through and the holidays causing havoc, but we finally managed to get there with contract signs and start dates in place. To sweeten the deal, the client has actually ended up taking two people on from the search, despite only wanting one at the beginning. A nice additional 10k fee to make it feel worth it.

Speaker 2: 7:43

This is now the seventh retainer I've placed with this client since introducing them to the concept in december last year. Here's to a few more with them next year.

Speaker 1: 7:50

Lovely, very nice well done, josh.

Speaker 1: 7:52

Yeah, very good yeah, and this is kelly. Uh, kelly, I've been working with kelly in the mastermind. She's already um moved from contingent to fully retained. She says uh, first multi-hire campaign pitch. So we're working on going up the value chain, winning bigger pieces of work and she's got stock straight in this week. She says I attended a face-to-face meeting with a client who invited me in following the first retainer that she just completed for them. They want to work with me on a retained multi-hire campaign for new middle management tier that they're looking to put in. We discuss future pipelining and talent mapping and this is brand new to Kelly. I'm absolutely delighted that she's already getting out there and talking about it. Just waiting on final confirmation for numbers of headcount and more clarity of geographic. So we put together a deck of how she was going to walk client through this. But they want to get things started this side of Christmas.

Speaker 1: 8:44

So, great, so excited through this um, but they want to get things started this side of christmas.

Speaker 2: 8:46

So great, so excited no, I always think as well. I think it's easy for people to think people like kelly achieving all this now can be a million miles away from some of the people listening. Well, I haven't. I first spoke to kelly and she was working for herself, fully, fully, contingent, mid-level fees. She's been on such an amazing journey in such a short space of time, yeah yeah, people surprise themselves, don't they?

Speaker 1: 9:12

Oh my God, this absolutely melted my heart. I was so happy to see this. I love Mary, I love her it sounds awful.

Speaker 2: 9:18

I know we shouldn't have favourites like your children. You shouldn't have favourites. We've got loads of favourites, but I'm really like Mary, deserves everything that's going to come her way.

Speaker 1: 9:27

She was so green, wasn't she? She was a grad, I think, first into recruitment. I think she had, like she'd been with Andrea about three months or something.

Speaker 2: 9:36

And Andrea's awesome, isn't she? Andrea's absolutely awesome.

Speaker 1: 9:39

But Mary was freshly hatched, literally had no experience at all, and Andrea was freshly hatched, literally had no experience at all, and Andrea put her on the course with her. They did it together and Mary god, she was like drinking from a fire hose for her. There was so much for her to learn and she did so well. She threw herself in and straight away she started diagnosing and pitching, but Andrea was always there to help her. And then out of the blue, we get this email, first retainer with no help. In capital letters she says hi, all, I miss you both. How are things? I'm smiling writing this right now because I've got my first retainer by myself, without any help along the way, from a cold call. She's so excited in capital letters and wanted to share and thank you for all your help along the way, and Mary is going to be an absolute superstar. So, yeah, even those of you that are really new to the industry, like don't let that stop.

Speaker 2: 10:29

You. Don't let that stop me. I remember, I remember one coaching session where mary and andre were on it. They were handling objections and I remember mary answered this objection. I could see it in andrew's face. It was like, yeah, maybe I just let mary do this.

Speaker 1: 10:42

Yeah I remember listening to some pitch and thinking, shit, mary's actually better in many ways than Andrea because she just absorbed it, she hadn't got any, she hadn't got any kind of bad habits or anything. And and I said, you know what? I think you should both be pitching to split it in half and get Mary to do one half and you do the Andrea's. But she's only just started. I said it's fine, she's good enough it was really good, yeah, this is nice, isn't it?

Speaker 1: 11:11

this makes me proud oh, bless you, you read it out so this Mike is based out in Florida.

Speaker 2: 11:21

He's promised me to get me on TPC Sawgrass, golf course, if I'm ever local, which which is a big deal.

Speaker 1: 11:25

I don't know what that means, but if it makes you happy, that's good.

Speaker 2: 11:28

So he said, celebrating a different type of win as a result of being a student of this wonderful community. I'd like to share my latest win on something a little bigger than a deal. I'm thrilled to announce a major addition to my business. Another of our members has joined him as a vice president and director of search. They both met in this program and seven months later, that person's made him work for it, but he's elated to make this announcement. I'm incredibly proud to appoint him into this influential leadership position, where he will oversee and improve the execution of our headhunting services. His passion for helping people advance in their careers and his dedication to doing what's best for all involved make him an invaluable addition to our team welcome.

Speaker 2: 12:15

Here is to a wonderful future filled with success, growth and transformative recruitment nice, I love it.

Speaker 1: 12:22

Changing lives, changing Changing bloody lives, george yeah.

Speaker 2: 12:27

But I think what? What made me think is how so many of the people that join us are have the same frustrations, the same mindset, though, the same approach to wanting to solve problems for customers and provide great service I'm not surprised that that type of thing's happened. That's because they both view things in the same way yeah, yeah, I agree, I get that in the mastermind.

Speaker 1: 12:52

They're like we've got a group all in a similar market but complementing locations, and they're forming like an alliance. It's incredible, it's so good. This is a real nice one as well. Uh, from tokyo, isn't it? Uh? Ryan says two big wins just issued a shortlist fee for one country manager search, the one at 40 percent, and won an even bigger general management search against two Shreks. I almost flopped the pitch, but Jordan helped me stay the course. Thank you, jordan. Did you give him a hand? Did you give him a stare?

Speaker 2: 13:23

on it. Yeah, ryan, doesn't need much staring.

Speaker 1: 13:26

No, he doesn't. He's very good now, sometimes it's just like a sense check.

Speaker 2: 13:29

Yeah, tell him to stick with it.

Speaker 1: 13:33

He says sometimes I wish I was moving faster. And I read that and I'm like fucking hell, how much faster does he want to be moving? Like he's absolutely flying. I saw others in the program pitching and winning much faster and more frequently than I did in the beginning stages, but I'm reminded that everyone has their own story and ultimately, in Lou Archer's words, professional persistence pays off, and that is absolutely true. So if you find yourself comparing with others, remember you're carving your own unique path, so stay true to you and trust the process.

Speaker 2: 14:03

Great advice. He is, you're older.

Speaker 1: 14:08

Oh, and there's a little one I noticed, so I'll just scoop this one up and pop this one in to share with you. Tracy dropped Sarah a message to say I've got a meeting for my message you helped me with on Friday.

Speaker 2: 14:19

Yay, yay, yay. Is that from the marketing, from Sarah's marketing? Yes, yeah, it's from.

Speaker 1: 14:23

Sarah's marketing course, which I love those of you externally won't know because it's only offered to our internal, our existing members at the moment which is our retrained marketing and automation course program, which Sarah is a coach in our head of marketing who does all our marketing. So if you hear our marketing, you like our marketing and you think shit, that's really good, then Sarah's the one to follow and she's building her, which is now like a third, two thirds built and people winning from it already.

Speaker 1: 14:56

Yeah birds built and people winning from it already. Yeah, um.

Speaker 1: 15:03

So this is the bit where we share with our listeners the stuff that we've been helping people with, and I found that recently the main topic for people wanting help is bd recently, and so I've been doing a lot of work with my mastermind members on focusing on BD between now and the end of the year to make sure next year's pipeline of meetings, of introductions, of diagnostics and, ultimately, work is really solid and there's plenty of activity going on. So, with quite a few of my members, we've been going back to focusing on identifying the targets and in some cases, some of the industries were shifting around a little bit. Things like the election in the US has had an impact on a couple of markets over there, green energy, clean tech being one of them. That's just like out the window all of a sudden, um, and so having to like move into allied industries.

Speaker 2: 16:03

It's not really funny video. Have you seen the video of donald trump talking about electric tanks? No but I'm not involved. I'm not. There's no political bias, I'm not involved in that at all. But I just really, really tickled. But he was talking about electric tanks and he was like, yeah, we're gonna push electric tanks so, you know, when we're in all these far-flung countries and we're blowing the hell out of them, we can make sure we're taking care of their environment yeah, I was just like really tickled me.

Speaker 2: 16:34

When I watched it I was like this guy is absolutely nuts. He is nuts, yeah.

Speaker 1: 16:39

Sorry. Yeah, we're expressing political opinions there, so probably shouldn't be. I mean not in terms of personality.

Speaker 2: 16:46

I have no axe to grind either way in US politics.

Speaker 1: 16:53

So back to BD. So we then we're either re-identifying targets or um shifting um identification into allied or uh, parallel markets and being really systematic about identifying those targets that have got some kind of link somehow somewhere to something we've done before or somewhere we've worked before or people we've worked with before, and then systematically identifying the people within those businesses and then identifying where their probable pain is. And with a few of my members we've been getting really deep on um working out where their probable pain might be by spending a bit of time like walking in their shoes, and it's been transformative for some, some people. And I've just come off a call with Mark who's just secured like five meetings for the next few weeks because he put together a piece that was based on the exercise that I got him to do, and the exercise that I've been getting them to do is the same as the exercise that I've been one of, the many, many, many things I've been doing as part of this Goldman Sachs course that I'm doing.

Speaker 1: 17:59

As some people will know, I'm harping on about it all the bloody time because it's so good. It's really hard work but it's very, very good. And what they um the marketing, one of the tools in the marketing is a customer empathy map. Uh, which is I mean? Actually I can probably share one on the screen for those of you that have got. You know the video going on, it's rabid value.

Speaker 1: 18:24

I mean, why not? Why not? It's very good and they get you to think very carefully about your customers' pains and the challenges that they might be facing. To be fair, it's very similar to what Dave Wollstoneham got us to do at the beginning, and it's similar to the exercise that he got everyone to do at our event in Australia, which is get into a customer. You know, think what's his name, where does he hang out, what does he do at the weekends, or she, and what do they have to achieve in their you know, in their role, and that's what, exactly what this gets you to do. So you start with, who are you empathizing with? Um, I think dave picked an example of like a construction manager or a construction director, and and then what do they need to do? So they need to deliver the project on time, you know to budget, um, and you've got to empathize with, like, their pains or their problems. What do they see? I don't know. They see people getting nicked by the competition and leaving the project early so he's got holes in his team, or they see people or things happening in the project that aren't being done right or not compliantly, or they see budgets slipping or whatever it might be the problems. And then what do they say about that? What do they do about it? What do they? What are they hearing around them? So what are their pains and what are their gains? And I've been helping people, like showing them what ours looks like, so ours is.

Speaker 1: 19:53

We're empathizing with leaders and managers of teams of recruiters. They need to deliver revenue for the business and forecast ability. They see people trying to win retained work and failing. They say, god, this is really frustrating. Make sure you get a retainer on that job. What do they do? They try and help the team, but they're not quite sure what to do to help. And what do they hear? They hear things like the internal retainer training's not working or, um, I'm frustrated, this, this fee's not going to come in. Or they've got pressure from above saying why are your forecasts so inaccurate? From forecast to actual. And it gets you to really think about what their frustrations are so that you can create content on their journey um, that actually helps them to to move forward in their role and in their position. So you're not just always going to them saying how can I help you with your talent acquisition. You're actually sharing things, because we've realized that by helping people like you listening like we'll do a free masterclass on something or we'll give you a free download and then we'll, and that actually helps you on your journey. So what can you do for your clients?

Speaker 1: 20:58

I did this session with Sabrina, one of our members who is doing the same thing, and she's realized that she works with a lot of micro, early stage founding businesses which often have got good investment, they're backed, they've got the money, but their biggest problem is she'll get partway down a search with them and then they'll go. Actually I don't know whether we need a coo. I think maybe we just need um, you know a really decent finance director and and that plugs that gap. And actually we probably just need an ops manager, not a coo. So stop right there, let's just go back a bit.

Speaker 1: 21:33

And she's like it's so frustrating and they're all the same. None of them know what, what to hire or when. So I said, well, what can think about this journey? What can we do on that journey to help them with that problem? So we had a big brainstorm and we did this exercise and she came, we came up with she can interview the people that have done it, have been on that journey, successfully navigated it. Take all the learnings from those interviews and share those learnings with the new founders by in clips, in downloads, in blogs, in, you know, in, do a master class, do a workshop, bring them together she's and suddenly she's full of content that she can go and take to her clients what we do is kind of what we try and do very much yeah, very much like what we do, and so what?

Speaker 1: 22:18

and paul press, who's um, sorry, I'm full of energy and ideas and got so much going on.

Speaker 1: 22:26

And paul, who's wonderfully a coach in our mastermind now and doing 250 350 grand a month in retained revenue, is an absolute machine and a master now of of this.

Speaker 1: 22:41

He was sharing exactly the same. I wasn't on that um call that he did, but apparently in the collab call that he did, uh, last week he was saying what's worked for him is this, this long game around? What can he do to help them in their role and share um and share insights and share knowledge and share learnings, um, and connect people, and that is now fruiting, basically for him. So we've been really diligent about every stage of this identifying the targets, identifying the people, identifying what the probable pains are and then taking them on a journey of a consistent like 12 step touch approach of LinkedIn, of an email, of sending an MPC, of sending sharing some insight, of sharing a case study, and it's working basically. But we also had a very good session with one of our well, several, because we've got several teams going through the course now of one of our biggest best clients, didn't we and you had quite um, it was a bit of a an awakening moment, wasn't it?

Speaker 2: 23:48

yeah, I think um, I mean, it was on the topic of bd again, and I think there are kind of two scat, two sides, I think, to bd. There's kind of the skill and there's the will a a little bit too, and often what I see is when people start trying to win more work on a retained basis, you've never seen people overthink things more, like it's everything that they've done in the past that has worked for them, though they sometimes stop doing that as well. And this team had been doing some BD and they've been using things like MPCs most placeable candidates as a means of generating conversation and opening doors to conversation, and I've been doing loads of BD. And okay, what does loads of BD look like? Well, this month I've sent out 12. Like, no matter how good you are, sometimes I think there's a numbers game to this as well yeah, like, oh definitely there is he said to me like how many should it?

Speaker 2: 24:44

be like 30, 40, and I was like like 300, 400, like like lots you know, and I suppose that's one of the biggest things that I've been working with that team on now is just upping the volume, oh yeah, but not doing it in a way that's scatty and all over the place, right like upping the volume in a way that's led by a process that's yeah, consistent, yeah achievable professionally persistent.

Speaker 1: 25:12

That's where we come back to, isn't it?

Speaker 2: 25:14

exactly so any of you that are listening that want to start going and winning more retained work. If you have means of BD at the moment on a contingent basis that open doors for you, don't stop opening the doors. Yeah, you need to change what we do when we go through the door.

Speaker 1: 25:32

Yeah, yeah, good, that's a great analogy, yeah. Oh very good, very good. I love my remarkable, I think it's wonderful, but or and as I should say, that's what I've noticed Rebecca does that.

Speaker 2: 25:47

She doesn't say but anymore, good catch.

Speaker 1: 25:51

And I do find it frustrating when it switches itself off or runs out of battery, because paper doesn't do that.

Speaker 2: 25:59

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 25:59

There is a drawback.

Speaker 2: 26:01

I use an iPad instead of a Remarkable, and I find it remarkable how poor the battery life is. I charge it overnight and then I do one Zoom call and I'm like what? 8%. I've done one Zoom call and I've done 8%.

Speaker 1: 26:17

But we don't really need to take notes anymore, do we? Because we have wonderful fathom.

Speaker 2: 26:21

Note takers yes, we do, you're right.

Speaker 1: 26:24

You're right. Anyway, I just have my notes to keep me on track. Controversy, that's the one You're on it.

Speaker 2: 26:32

So I've got one. Yes, so I had a call this week with a recruiter who said something that blew me away. It blew my mind. So this recruiter works for a well-established firm. My understanding is they do some contingent and they do some retained, but they do quite a lot of retained right. It's not a concept that's new to them. This person has taken over a search from another consultant I don't know whether they've left, but I don't know what's happened. But she's taken over a search from another consultant. I don't know whether they've left, but I don't know what's happened. But she's taken over this search and said it's a little bit of a nightmare. The client isn't in the habit of doing steering calls and they didn't want to re-brief her or anything like that. And frustratingly, she's been told when expressing her concerns by her boss to just work it contingently. And if the client gets upset and frustrated and it all ends up going to crap, then no problem, that's great, just run away with the retainer oh my god I was like sorry, what Like repeat that for me?

Speaker 2: 27:42

Oh, I can't believe it.

Speaker 1: 27:43

And I isn't that the problem? That isn't that the problem? Isn't that the problem? Like apart hearing that, I just think, oh my God, almighty, that's why we've, we're creators, have got such a bad, bad name and that's why you meet so many people that go yeah, I've tried, retained, it was awful. I'm never doing that again. But then at the same time, it makes me see how much room there is for improvement and those that do do it properly, how we can stand out.

Speaker 1: 28:21

There aren't many of them that do properly no, there aren't many of them that do it.

Speaker 2: 28:24

It makes me laugh when I speak to people. Some people come to us and say I've been no retained and it's really clear what, why they need the help. They get it, yeah. But sometimes I speak to people I say yeah, I've firmed, there's loads retained, we don't need help and I'm you're probably one of the main ones that needs the help.

Speaker 1: 28:40

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 28:42

Often there are so many improvements that can be made to an existing retained process.

Speaker 1: 28:49

Well, and you know no more than we work with a firm in the US, didn't? We, who were all retained, all 100% retained? Everything was retained and it's all 100% retained. Everything was retained and it's all very well being able to say that, yeah, we're all retained and people think, oh right, that's, you must be fine. Then you must be fine.

Speaker 1: 29:07

But in the same way that just getting the financial commitment doesn't solve the problem, it doesn't that getting the financial commitment or the money upfront from the client doesn't mean that you're suddenly going to be able to to fill the position. No, it's the process that you put in place that means that you're gonna be. It's the same for a business. Just because you're retained doesn't mean that you haven't got all these problems with delivery, um, the length of time it takes to deliver, finding candidates and in and so. So often, when we're working with a firm that's already got a retained process in place, it's it's worse than as if they hadn't got a retained process in place because they've got that financial commitment and then they haven't got a rigor and um framework around the delivery, so that it's just been botched together over a period of years, like how do we get through it?

Speaker 2: 30:03

and the way I see it you know I love my analogies it's like if I stuck someone on a car park in a car that couldn't drive and I put them there for 10 hours a day for a couple of weeks. After a couple of weeks they could probably drive that car. They'd figure it out. They'd be able to drive from A to B. But if you put them with a proper driving instructor, after three months, having self-learned, be out in five minutes oh my God, you're not safe. Why are you not checking your blind spot there? Why are you not doing that Like you are going to die?

Speaker 1: 30:31

But you just and they just cut the time down, don't you? Massively, because one of the biggest um frustrations that I see are people that have been putting in a retained model, in and and not quite sure what. What they need to be mindful of is that projects just go on and on and on, and the problem with that is you end up with some financial commitment, so you're committed to it, so you can't just walk away from it, although by the sounds of it, some people do, which is horrific um, but you can't just walk away from it, although by the sounds of it, some people do, which is horrific. Um, but you can't just walk away from it because of your reputation. And you've got that financial commitment and yet you don't, you can't fill it.

Speaker 1: 31:07

So that's a worse position than if it was contingent, because you could just go you haven't got yeah, yeah, you've got commitment, but your profit margins are squeezed and just getting like eroded away, and that's what happens and that's why they end up coming to us, because the profit margins are getting really eroded by projects that just go on and on and on. That they can't put down because they've got a relationship with the clients and it's too valuable.

Speaker 2: 31:30

And then it becomes difficult to make sustainable because all your consultants are saying I really don't want to do that again and they don't want to take retainers because it's god awful and it takes forever.

Speaker 1: 31:38

It's like a ball and bloody chain.

Speaker 2: 31:40

Yeah, so, yeah, um if you hear someone say we're all retained.

Speaker 1: 31:44

It doesn't necessarily mean that they're having a good time. And if you're out there and you are struggling or, you know, maybe having frustrations with a model that isn't quite optimized for you know profitability, then we've got a lot of experience, and if anyone um ever tells you to just deliver it contingently oh my god, please don't do that I I was once told that um, but was very lucky to have louise on the other show no do not, no way, no way.

Speaker 1: 32:15

You, you gonna do that um and so, um, yeah, I wanted to do a little piece on mindset and that is touching on what I was saying before, which is just spend in times where it's a little bit quieter, where just asking clients for have they got any needs and what do they need help with from a talent acquisition perspective, and it doesn't feel like the right thing to do, because there's only so many times you can ask them that.

Speaker 1: 32:42

Spend a bit of time in their shoes and thinking about what they need to achieve in their role and their position and what can you actually help them with constructively because of who you know, or because of what you're exposed to, or because of connections you're exposed to, or because of connections you can make, because of knowledge that you can um, you know you can draw from from one place and then impart to another. That's actually going to help them move forward on that journey and therefore move forward on their buying journey with you, because it does two things it moves them forward and it also puts you as a position as a trusted advisor of someone that knows and is out in the market and providing this kind of information. And do as much of that as you can and it will pay you back in spades.

Speaker 2: 33:25

It will.

Speaker 1: 33:28

So that's it from us today. Yeah thank you Lou, thank you, george, nice to see you.

Speaker 2: 33:35

Back to tummy time.

Speaker 1: 33:37

Back to tummy time. Bye everyone. Thanks for listening.

Speaker 2: 33:40

See you soon.

Speaker 1: 33:43

Well, that's another episode of Retrained Search the podcast in the bag. Thanks for listening to our wild tales, linkedin controversies and our top tips on how to sell and deliver Retained Search. Get involved in our next episode. Send in your questions and share your experiences with us by emailing podcast at retrainedsearchcom. And don't be shy. Connect with us on LinkedIn and come and say hi, we don't bite, unless you're a Shrek firm, that is.

Speaker 1: 34:12

We want to say a special thank you to our retrained members for sharing what's working for them right now and innovating new ways to grow and evolve. It's an incredible community. If you're wondering what exactly we mean when we mention our communities, well, we have two separate programs. Our Search Foundations program is for recruiters who want to learn how to sell and deliver retained search solutions consistently, and we have our Search Mastery Program. That's for business leaders or owners already at 50% retained or more and looking to scale and grow and structure their search firm. We cap memberships to these programs to protect the integrity of the community. If you want access, just talk to us. Okay, thanks for listening. We'll be back very soon with another episode of Retrain Search the podcast.